Message Board Thread - "Insulated Glass Evaluation"

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Insulated Glass Evaluation dandersen 3/6/2009
This is the first real good bull's-eye pattern I've come across in a defective insulated window.

Actually this window was the newest window in the house and 90% of the other Windows had turned almost completely white between the glass and they did not show this pattern.

I have frequently checked windows that I knew were bad but I have not come across anything like this yet. This one came by surprise as I was walking around just adjusting my camera. I saw the window through a pass through into the kitchen and it caught my eye.

Does anyone know the exact criteria needed for this anomaly to occur? It was about 37° outside and there was an HVAC ducts below the window. About 71° indoor air temperature (Don't pay attention to the scale, emissivity was not adjusted, this is what happens when you don't do that by the way). There was a small amount of condensation in the upper right corner of the window that I later found.

I have read that conditions for this anomaly can be difficult sometimes, but I don't have any more information than that.
 
Re:Insulated Glass Evaluation Ben10 3/10/2009
Looks like the glass as lost is argon.
 
Re:Insulated Glass Evaluation dandersen 3/10/2009
"Does anyone know the exact criteria needed for this anomaly to occur?"

Yes, the Argon is missing...

What makes it look like this?
 
Re:Insulated Glass Evaluation Gary Orlove 3/17/2009
The window loses its Argon, but the Argon is not replaced with air, so a partial vacuum is created that squeezes the window panes closer together in the center, and increases the heat transfer. Hence we see a cold area where the increased heat transfer takes place.
 
Re:Insulated Glass Evaluation dandersen 3/18/2009
Thank you very much Sir!
 
Re:Insulated Glass Evaluation glassman 4/2/2009
HI this is a common issue and I am surprised that it has not come up before. so here is the real answer.
When a double glazed unit is made you have two sheets of glass pareallel to each other. If they are perfectly aligned you end up with a rainbow effect when looked at from certain angles caled 'Brewers Finge' this is not a defect but a natural occurance. In the image that has been posted it is a fact that the glass is not perfectly parallel and as such the thermal integrity is comprimised as it will be colder in the middle. This double glazed unit was most probably made in a horizontal position and as such the center of the glass has sagged.This is further supported by the fact in very extreme conditions a dew spot will manifest in the centre of the unit. This is an indication that the panes are very close or that they are touching. As I have said this is common on either horizontal production lines or low volume hand made units.You have not said how old the glass unit is so it may predate gas insertion production. I hope this helps
The Verifier
 
Re:Insulated Glass Evaluation scanIRjim 4/2/2009
This IS a defect to the glass and I have seen this on many occasions. I actually have a window like this posted on my web site.
This defect is unique to Andersen Windows. Andersen, I contacted them, refers to this defect as collapsed glass. If you find winows like this and they are in fact Andersens have your client contact Andersen. They will usually replace or credit the customer for the bad glass.
 
Re:Insulated Glass Evaluation Peter 4/2/2009
scanIRjim wrote:
a defect to the glass and I have seen this on many occasions. I actually have a window like this posted on my web site.
This defect is unique to Andersen Windows. Andersen, I contacted them, refers to this defect as collapsed glass. If you find winows like this and they are in fact Andersens have your client contact Andersen. They will usually replace or credit the customer for the bad glass.
Do you have a contact name and number for Anderson?
 
Re:Insulated Glass Evaluation nmuller 4/3/2009
Does this pattern change with different conditions on this this particular window?

Has anyone ever tracked if those patterns change?
 
Re:Insulated Glass Evaluation dandersen 4/3/2009
I seldom get to go back, and this is the first real good one I found.
 
Re:Insulated Glass Evaluation InDemand Inc. 4/7/2009
scanIRjim wrote:
a defect to the glass and I have seen this on many occasions. I actually have a window like this posted on my web site.
This defect is unique to Andersen Windows. Andersen, I contacted them, refers to this defect as collapsed glass. If you find winows like this and they are in fact Andersens have your client contact Andersen. They will usually replace or credit the customer for the bad glass.
Dont be so sure with Anderson repairs. I bought $80,000 worth of windows for a home I was building, and window problems ocured even before instaltion. I fought with them for over a year without any resolve. I will never recommend Anderson, or the suppier I bought from.
 
Re:Insulated Glass Evaluation InDemand Inc. 4/7/2009
scanIRjim wrote:
a defect to the glass and I have seen this on many occasions. I actually have a window like this posted on my web site.
This defect is unique to Andersen Windows. Andersen, I contacted them, refers to this defect as collapsed glass. If you find winows like this and they are in fact Andersens have your client contact Andersen. They will usually replace or credit the customer for the bad glass.
Dont be so sure with Anderson repairs. I bought $80,000 worth of windows for a home I was building, and window problems ocured even before insallation. I fought with them for over a year without any resolve. I will never recommend Anderson, or the suppier I bought from.
 
Re:Insulated Glass Evaluation ASRD Steve 4/7/2009
dandersen wrote:
the first real good bull's-eye pattern I've come across in a defective insulated window.

Actually this window was the newest window in the house and 90% of the other Windows had turned almost completely white between the glass and they did not show this pattern.

I have frequently checked windows that I knew were bad but I have not come across anything like this yet. This one came by surprise as I was walking around just adjusting my camera. I saw the window through a pass through into the kitchen and it caught my eye.

Does anyone know the exact criteria needed for this anomaly to occur? It was about 37° outside and there was an HVAC ducts below the window. About 71° indoor air temperature (Don't pay attention to the scale, emissivity was not adjusted, this is what happens when you don't do that by the way). There was a small amount of condensation in the upper right corner of the window that I later found.

I have read that conditions for this anomaly can be difficult sometimes, but I don't have any more information than that.
This is the best information that I game across

Go to this link and register

http://www.thesnellgroup.com/ReceiveWhitePapers.aspx?id=10006

I used it to persuade the manufacturer of my windows to replace one that had imploded.
 
Re:Insulated Glass Evaluation windasman 11/10/2009
scanIRjim wrote:
a defect to the glass and I have seen this on many occasions. I actually have a window like this posted on my web site.
This defect is unique to Andersen Windows. Andersen, I contacted them, refers to this defect as collapsed glass. If you find winows like this and they are in fact Andersens have your client contact Andersen. They will usually replace or credit the customer for the bad glass.
Actually, just so the full information is out there, this problem is NOT unique to Andersen. As an Andersen factory-trained service technician based in northern Indiana, I have seen many windows from nearly every possible manufacturer that have this problem, including brand-new or almost new windows. It is actually a defect in the technology of the spacer between the panes of glass.
I say this not to defend Andersen, this problem is my main moneymaker ;), but just to let everyone know that if they have the same trouble with another manufacturer, contact them. An easy way to check, if the location and size of the window allow, is put your fingers or other easily moved object on each side of the glass around the edge and work yourself toward the center, seeing if they get close together. Another way is to put a straightedge on the face of the glass and see if it bows away from the straightedge. I have a laser gauge that is very precise, but if it's bad enough, even a novice with basic tools can check it. It is also easy to see a collapsed window from the outside, as the reflection will be extremely distorted-I see them all the time from the street when I'm driving.
If you have any further questions, you can email me if you wish-
ken.hochstetler@comcast.net
 


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